OE Webex 13Sep07
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09/13/2007 16:32:24 PM from Jen Deegan to All Attendees: Hi Alex 09/13/2007 16:32:41 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Hi, everyone. 09/13/2007 16:32:45 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I wrote to some cns experts 09/13/2007 16:32:47 PM from Erika to All Participants: Hi John 09/13/2007 16:32:57 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: our host has arrived! everybody switch to "all participants" 09/13/2007 16:33:04 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: Hi All 09/13/2007 16:33:15 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: What did they say? 09/13/2007 16:33:19 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: nothing yet 09/13/2007 16:33:27 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: waiting with baited breath though 09/13/2007 16:33:40 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I'm sure all will be well either way though 09/13/2007 16:33:50 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: how is iceland? 09/13/2007 16:33:59 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: I'm trying to have more plasticity with my feelings about these terms! 09/13/2007 16:34:11 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: good luck! A very laudable aim. 09/13/2007 16:34:11 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: Sunny today, rainy most others. 09/13/2007 16:34:15 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: ah 09/13/2007 16:34:22 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Does anyone know if Karen is going to make it this time? If she is, I'll spend a few more seconds trying to get this feature working... 09/13/2007 16:34:31 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Until she shows up. 09/13/2007 16:34:33 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: not sure 09/13/2007 16:34:42 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: I haven't heard 09/13/2007 16:34:57 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Let's give her 3 minutes, then. I'll be back in a moment. 09/13/2007 16:35:08 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: will there be demos today? 09/13/2007 16:35:12 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: should I get ready to record 09/13/2007 16:35:28 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: I think John is doing some last minute coding. 09/13/2007 16:35:32 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: ah 09/13/2007 16:36:06 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: I've been hoping for a B13 since B12 was unusable for me. 09/13/2007 16:36:20 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: there does seem to be one in the offing 09/13/2007 16:36:24 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: I'm glad I'm not the only one. 09/13/2007 16:36:30 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: And wreaked all my preferences. 09/13/2007 16:36:45 PM from Tanya to All Participants: I finally figured out how to get b12 to work. 09/13/2007 16:36:48 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: Luckily, I'd saved mine ... but I can't use them. 09/13/2007 16:36:50 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: it starts and loads for me but is a bit batty after that 09/13/2007 16:37:07 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: how? 09/13/2007 16:37:11 PM from Tanya to All Participants: But I admit haven't been able to figure out the graph based editing too well. 09/13/2007 16:37:19 PM from Tanya to All Participants: Deleted the .oboeditbeta directory. 09/13/2007 16:37:29 PM from Tanya to All Participants: For the longest time, I couldn't delete one file therein 09/13/2007 16:37:32 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: we decided the other week not to worry about the graph editor 09/13/2007 16:37:45 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: john said we can put that to one side to get the rest of the tool out of the door. 09/13/2007 16:37:47 PM from Tanya to All Participants: turned out that even though I didn't think I had any apps running 09/13/2007 16:37:56 PM from Tanya to All Participants: there were some 'zombie' oboedits hanging about 09/13/2007 16:37:56 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Okay, I'm back. I got the feature working. 09/13/2007 16:38:02 PM from Tanya to All Participants: that I had to manually kill. 09/13/2007 16:38:05 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I had that too tanya 09/13/2007 16:38:05 PM from Tanya to All Participants: Anyway... 09/13/2007 16:38:18 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Okay, shall we get into it? 09/13/2007 16:38:19 PM from Tanya to All Participants: Hi John! 09/13/2007 16:38:22 PM from Tanya to All Participants: Let's GO! 09/13/2007 16:38:22 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: yes 09/13/2007 16:38:23 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: Sure 09/13/2007 16:38:39 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Okay, first thing: Regarding the need to delete the .oboeditbeta directory... 09/13/2007 16:39:31 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I know that's annoying, but I don't see a good way around it. Every time I adjust the way the preferences are stored (and this is often necessary when I add a new feature or improve an existing feature), the old .oboeditbeta directory can get... 09/13/2007 16:40:09 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: That's okay, but we need to be warned ahead of time. 09/13/2007 16:40:18 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: I second that! 09/13/2007 16:40:39 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: seriously out of sync. But it is often very difficult to detect that it *has* gotten out of sync. I'm going to need to write a fairly complex tool for porting old .oboeditbeta data. It's pointless to write such a tool until the final release, because - 09/13/2007 16:40:47 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I'd have to rewrite it for each version of the program. 09/13/2007 16:41:07 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I don't mind deleting mine 09/13/2007 16:41:11 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: If you'd like, I can make the installer automatically delete your old settings. 09/13/2007 16:41:13 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I'm not even editing with 2.000 yet 09/13/2007 16:41:23 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: that would be good 09/13/2007 16:41:39 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: The real hassle is restoring everything ... 09/13/2007 16:41:54 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I don't really have much to restore on 2.000 yet 09/13/2007 16:42:11 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: is it the dbxrefs? 09/13/2007 16:42:21 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: copying over just the things you suggested didn't work. 09/13/2007 16:43:03 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: Jen - it's everything; f onts, layout, relatinoship iconss, load & save profiles, etc. 09/13/2007 16:43:18 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Yeah, I know. My attempts to write a porting guide for you made me realize the complexity of this task. That's why I've decided it may be best to just delete your beta settings when you install. 09/13/2007 16:43:20 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: (apologies for atrocious typing there) 09/13/2007 16:43:44 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: Yes, one can't get too invested in personalizing the program yet. 09/13/2007 16:43:57 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: that was what I figured 09/13/2007 16:44:12 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: it's still quite buggy so we may as well wait until it's more fixed 09/13/2007 16:44:19 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: If I don't change the font I can't use it! (The rest isn't so critical, I know ...) 09/13/2007 16:44:29 PM from Tanya to All Participants: At least it doesn't screw up the 'official' version when you delete the .oboeditbeta dir 09/13/2007 16:44:33 PM from Tanya to All Participants: which would be really bad. 09/13/2007 16:44:37 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: can you change the font in the config text file 09/13/2007 16:44:49 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: might save clicking 09/13/2007 16:45:19 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: There's another solution, I guess... 09/13/2007 16:45:51 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I could write a tool that ports OBO-Edit 1.x settings over to OBO-Edit 2.0 - that's easier, because OBO-Edit 1.x settings are stable. 09/13/2007 16:46:03 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: When you install, OBO-Edit 2 could always re-import your settings. 09/13/2007 16:46:08 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: that would be good 09/13/2007 16:46:21 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: you could also notch the default font up one. 09/13/2007 16:46:26 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: oooh, I like it! 09/13/2007 16:46:46 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: Just having the load and save profiles would be great. 09/13/2007 16:47:07 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: and the visible font ... 09/13/2007 16:47:13 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Okay - I'll do it that way. Then you can maintain your stable settings in OBO-Edit 1.x 09/13/2007 16:47:22 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: (says the broken record ... remember records?) 09/13/2007 16:47:25 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: A question about fonts, then... 09/13/2007 16:47:45 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Should I not set the font at all, and just let OBO-Edit use the system default? 09/13/2007 16:48:11 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I don't really know how to set that 09/13/2007 16:48:16 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: What is the system default though? 09/13/2007 16:48:31 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: you could maybe just make the default bigger 09/13/2007 16:48:35 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Different on every platform, but it probably looks a lot like the font you're seeing in webex now. 09/13/2007 16:48:38 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I always adjust it up too 09/13/2007 16:49:32 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: As long as people using the program for the first time don't get an odd display. 09/13/2007 16:49:51 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: What font size are people using when they reset it in OBO-Edit? 09/13/2007 16:50:03 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I'll just check 09/13/2007 16:50:07 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: (It has to work on all platforms all the time) 09/13/2007 16:50:19 PM from Harold to All Participants: I'm using 12, but it would also have to do with the users current resolution setting for their display 09/13/2007 16:50:30 PM from Erika to All Participants: 14 size 09/13/2007 16:50:44 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: 12 09/13/2007 16:50:51 PM from Harold to All Participants: as well as their age 8-) 09/13/2007 16:50:56 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: probably 12 09/13/2007 16:51:14 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: mine's 14; it also depends on the font, but assuming you only change the size, don't worry about that. 09/13/2007 16:51:16 PM from Erika to All Participants: if i am working on laptop I use 12 09/13/2007 16:51:28 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Okay, I'll change the default to be 12. And I'll try to work on the OBO-Edit 1.x settings port. 09/13/2007 16:51:42 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Next topic, then: 09/13/2007 16:51:57 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: if you make it 12, I'll be able to read it well enough to change it if I want to ;) 09/13/2007 16:52:23 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I've plugged the new feature request priorities into my spreadsheet, and bulk editing is now the most popular feature request. 09/13/2007 16:52:53 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: Would that cover bulk cross-product editing too, a la Chris' matrix suggestion? 09/13/2007 16:53:16 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: Should we not get the rest of the application bug free before addign more features? I thought you wanted to release quite soon. 09/13/2007 16:53:44 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I'm hamstrung by the difficult problem of being totally unable to reproduce many of the bug reports I'm getting. 09/13/2007 16:53:58 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: really? 09/13/2007 16:54:05 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: the whole thing seems very buggy to me 09/13/2007 16:54:18 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: hmm 09/13/2007 16:54:27 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I replied to a number of your bug reports, Jen. I could only make one of them happen. 09/13/2007 16:54:32 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: oh 09/13/2007 16:54:41 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: But I fixed it immediately. 09/13/2007 16:54:47 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: Thanks :-) 09/13/2007 16:54:55 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: How can I help with the other ones? 09/13/2007 16:55:03 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: Should I give you more information on them? 09/13/2007 16:55:07 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: A while back you said the movies of bugs in action helped ... should we try to do more of that sort of thing? 09/13/2007 16:55:10 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I think I need people to bring their bugs to office hours on Monday. 09/13/2007 16:55:32 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: Kind of like show 'n' tell 09/13/2007 16:55:36 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: If we made little movies would that help too? 09/13/2007 16:55:50 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: Office hours are quite short for us as you start as we finish 09/13/2007 16:56:19 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: Hmmm ... I'm willing, but it's now difficult for me to make 5-6 pm on Mondays. Can I (or Jen, or both of us) arrange a different time individually? 09/13/2007 16:56:20 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Movies aren't so helpful. I need to see bugs in action, because I often want to say, "okay, try this now" 09/13/2007 16:56:30 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: ah 09/13/2007 16:56:32 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: yes I see 09/13/2007 16:56:51 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: can you get up earlier? 09/13/2007 16:56:56 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: :-) 09/13/2007 16:57:13 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Let's arrange a different time. I can do office hours this Monday starting at 7am my time. 09/13/2007 16:57:24 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: eek! that's early! 09/13/2007 16:57:36 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Logan wakes up at 5, usually, so it's not that bad. 09/13/2007 16:57:41 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: I'm impressed. But it would work well for us ... 09/13/2007 16:57:43 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: oh okay then. 09/13/2007 16:57:45 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: that would be great 09/13/2007 16:57:47 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: thanks 09/13/2007 16:58:00 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: ah yes ... you've got the extra-effective style of alarm clock ;) 09/13/2007 16:58:09 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I will save up some demos 09/13/2007 16:58:16 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I mean to show at the time 09/13/2007 16:58:27 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Nice. I'll have a new release out by then, so maybe I'll have fixed some of your problems. 09/13/2007 16:58:34 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Speaking of demos, on to the next thing... 09/13/2007 16:58:36 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: great, thanks 09/13/2007 16:58:49 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: I may not have much this coming monday (because of the #%&%# NAR paper) but I'll turn up anyway. 09/13/2007 16:59:00 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I have plenty to keep us going 09/13/2007 16:59:10 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Is there anything we want to show/do with OBO-Edit at the consortium meeting? 09/13/2007 16:59:21 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: we could show the funky layout 09/13/2007 16:59:26 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Are there any features that I need to focus on getting demo-ready for anyone's presentation, or anything like that? 09/13/2007 16:59:28 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: it's nice and it works well 09/13/2007 16:59:34 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: nothing for me 09/13/2007 17:00:11 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Well, that was easy, then. 09/13/2007 17:00:12 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: there's a slot on the draft agenda, but no specifics, no it is up to us. 09/13/2007 17:00:18 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: maybe you could ask chris if you could show the layout in the software talk 09/13/2007 17:00:30 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: ... er, "so it's up to us" 09/13/2007 17:00:34 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: By "layout", do you mean the drag and drop panels? 09/13/2007 17:00:38 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: yes 09/13/2007 17:00:51 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: If we've got a slot for demoing, I thought I'd show: 09/13/2007 17:00:52 PM from Tanya to All Participants: Sorry, got to go to other meeting now. Will see the transcripts. 09/13/2007 17:00:52 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I think they're quite cool 09/13/2007 17:00:58 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: * Layouts 09/13/2007 17:01:01 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: * New search interface 09/13/2007 17:01:05 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: * Graph-based editing 09/13/2007 17:01:19 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: Bizarrely, the OEwg talk is listed under Aim 3, which is "annotation across all organisms". 09/13/2007 17:01:21 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: * New text editor 09/13/2007 17:01:31 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Huh. That is bizarre. 09/13/2007 17:01:42 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I think the graph based editor may need some work still 09/13/2007 17:01:48 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: but the others are good 09/13/2007 17:01:57 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Jen - you're right, but I can make it work well enough for a proof of concept demo. 09/13/2007 17:02:01 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: The slot doesn't say demo, but it also doesn't say not demo ... and I think a demo would be a great way to show progress. 09/13/2007 17:02:02 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: ok 09/13/2007 17:02:05 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: I think the graph editor is already useful as a viewer. 09/13/2007 17:02:14 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Which brings me to today's demo! 09/13/2007 17:02:30 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: <dromroll> 09/13/2007 17:02:37 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: <drumroll> 09/13/2007 17:02:46 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: (joke damaged by typo) 09/13/2007 17:02:50 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: :-) 09/13/2007 17:03:02 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I got tired of the terrible performance of the graph animations, and I discovered that the problem was coming from the difficulty in calculating those parent and child lists for every node. 09/13/2007 17:03:26 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: what do you mean by terrible performance? 09/13/2007 17:03:35 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: They seemed plenty fast for me. 09/13/2007 17:03:53 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: The animations were jerky in beta12, because of the way I had to change the graph editor to accomodate filtering. 09/13/2007 17:04:12 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: Oh, never got to see that... 09/13/2007 17:04:16 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: me neither 09/13/2007 17:04:35 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Anyway, I think the new proposal gives us a cleaner interface and speeds up graph redrawing. 09/13/2007 17:04:49 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Give me a few secs to prep the screen sharing... 09/13/2007 17:06:26 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Can you see OBO-Edit? 09/13/2007 17:06:31 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: yep 09/13/2007 17:06:54 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: oops, no, gone agani as soon as I hit send ... 09/13/2007 17:06:57 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: it's hidden behind the WebEx window (yours not mine) 09/13/2007 17:07:09 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: The new interface doesn't show any expand collapse controls until you mouse over, and then this is what you see... 09/13/2007 17:07:09 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: comng back now 09/13/2007 17:07:09 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: now I see it 09/13/2007 17:07:10 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: Now it's there. 09/13/2007 17:07:17 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: got it 09/13/2007 17:07:22 PM from Erika to All Participants: I can see it 09/13/2007 17:07:32 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: gone again 09/13/2007 17:07:39 PM from melissaH to All Participants: gone for me too 09/13/2007 17:07:40 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: same here 09/13/2007 17:07:44 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: you might want to minimise the webex window 09/13/2007 17:08:13 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: or just share oboedit instead of the desktop 09/13/2007 17:08:28 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: This should work better - I can't minimize it and still type. 09/13/2007 17:08:57 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: crashed again. 09/13/2007 17:09:02 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Let me try something else - sigh... 09/13/2007 17:09:18 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: can you report that crash on the webstie when you log out midori? 09/13/2007 17:10:12 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: are you having trouble there? 09/13/2007 17:10:12 PM from Harold to All Participants: I keep seeing a black screen pop up 09/13/2007 17:10:23 PM from Erika to All Participants: black scree for me too 09/13/2007 17:10:27 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: me too 09/13/2007 17:10:29 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: I did too, briefly. 09/13/2007 17:10:34 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: You shouldn't be seeing anything now - I stopped sharing. 09/13/2007 17:10:39 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: john is trying to application share but not succeeeding 09/13/2007 17:11:11 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I'm now building and installer and installing OBO-Edit, because Webex can't share OBO-Edit when I run it from my Java editing environment 09/13/2007 17:11:20 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: (building AN installer) 09/13/2007 17:11:22 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: true 09/13/2007 17:12:00 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: what platform are yo on? 09/13/2007 17:12:03 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: mac os 09/13/2007 17:12:10 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I thought this worked on the man 09/13/2007 17:12:12 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: mac 09/13/2007 17:12:14 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: hmm 09/13/2007 17:12:37 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I think the problem has to do with the way that WebEx retrieves its window list from the operating system. 09/13/2007 17:12:38 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: maybe it was wwindows where you could chat and demo at the same time 09/13/2007 17:13:05 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: yes tht bit does not work, but there is one platform where you can't chat and demo and another where it is just really really hard. 09/13/2007 17:13:22 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Okay, here we go. 09/13/2007 17:13:59 PM from Harold to All Participants: it looked like it was working 09/13/2007 17:14:06 PM from Erika to All Participants: it is gone now 09/13/2007 17:14:15 PM from Erika to All Participants: it worked for a sec 09/13/2007 17:14:16 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I can't type and demo at the same time, so watch for the popup controls as I mouse over terms... 09/13/2007 17:14:26 PM from Erika to All Participants: ok 09/13/2007 17:15:11 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Could you see that? 09/13/2007 17:15:14 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: yes 09/13/2007 17:15:17 PM from Harold to All Participants: yup 09/13/2007 17:15:17 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: that did seem better 09/13/2007 17:15:21 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: Those controls do look easier to find. 09/13/2007 17:15:33 PM from melissaH to All Participants: Ilike it too 09/13/2007 17:15:47 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: The question is, do you miss not having the at-a-glance information about how many children/parents a node has? 09/13/2007 17:15:52 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: no 09/13/2007 17:15:56 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: no 09/13/2007 17:16:15 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: no; in fact, it was kind of distracting to see if a term had lots of children 09/13/2007 17:16:25 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: ... the list would extend past the term bubble. 09/13/2007 17:16:31 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: in the little dot 09/13/2007 17:16:38 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: you could make it bring up a list of the children 09/13/2007 17:16:43 PM from melissaH to All Participants: presumably the bottom buttons would be hidden if there was no children? 09/13/2007 17:16:47 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: if you right click and 09/13/2007 17:16:53 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: then you could choose the one you want 09/13/2007 17:17:07 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Yeah - you'd only see buttons if they were appropriate. 09/13/2007 17:17:41 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Jen - I like your idea. If you right-click you'd get a menu like the hide/show menu at the bottom of the regular right-click menu, but with items appropriate to the button you clicked. 09/13/2007 17:17:48 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: yes 09/13/2007 17:18:06 PM from Erika to All Participants: good idea, Jen! 09/13/2007 17:18:11 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: that would be very intuitive I think and would mean we don't suddently get thousands of terms cluttering things up 09/13/2007 17:18:12 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: That would be great 09/13/2007 17:18:16 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: oh good 09/13/2007 17:18:17 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: :-) 09/13/2007 17:18:31 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I suppose some lists would be very very big 09/13/2007 17:18:41 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: whch might be bad 09/13/2007 17:18:44 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I also thought I'd show some kind of warning on a button (like a little exclamation point, or the icon in red or something) if clicking the button would expand > 10 new terms. 09/13/2007 17:19:14 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: good idea 09/13/2007 17:19:25 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: in tht case we can use the search to find the term 09/13/2007 17:19:41 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I'd also hide the list of individual terms in a sub-menu, so you'd only see the huge list of terms if you wanted to. 09/13/2007 17:20:00 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I don't get you 09/13/2007 17:20:16 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: In the right click menu, the items would be something like: 09/13/2007 17:20:19 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: * Show all children 09/13/2007 17:20:24 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: * Show particular child... 09/13/2007 17:20:33 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: * Show all descendants... 09/13/2007 17:20:54 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: yes that sounds good 09/13/2007 17:20:56 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: The items with a ... after them would bring up a nested menu when you mouse over them. 09/13/2007 17:21:10 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: we'd better start working up our right click muscles 09/13/2007 17:21:27 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: increase their plasticity 09/13/2007 17:21:33 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: exactly 09/13/2007 17:21:36 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: :-) 09/13/2007 17:21:49 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I guess I'm done. Anything else anyone wants to discuss? 09/13/2007 17:21:57 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: you know in the graph viewer 09/13/2007 17:21:59 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: editor 09/13/2007 17:22:08 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: could you possibly make the boxes smaller? 09/13/2007 17:22:22 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: currently we need to drag the graph around a lot to see what's going on 09/13/2007 17:22:28 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: but it's mostly all box 09/13/2007 17:22:31 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: not all term 09/13/2007 17:22:45 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Do you want the boxes to be sized so that they're just bigger than the text? 09/13/2007 17:22:51 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: yes please 09/13/2007 17:22:59 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: it cuts down on dragging and that's good 09/13/2007 17:23:12 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: like in the normal dag edotr 09/13/2007 17:23:15 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: editori 09/13/2007 17:23:17 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: oh dear 09/13/2007 17:23:20 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: can't spell 09/13/2007 17:23:24 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I can work on that. 09/13/2007 17:23:29 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: so everything is very concenced 09/13/2007 17:23:31 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: sed 09/13/2007 17:23:41 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: ta 09/13/2007 17:23:51 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Are you having a stroke? 09/13/2007 17:23:54 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: yes 09/13/2007 17:24:14 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: hunger..... need cheese 09/13/2007 17:24:24 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I'll do my best to make the display more concencedsedta 09/13/2007 17:24:33 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: that would be most kind. 09/13/2007 17:24:38 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: :-) 09/13/2007 17:25:09 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: can't type for laughing now 09/13/2007 17:25:10 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: Okay, if you have bugs, please show up to the extended office hours on Monay. I'll be open from 7-11:00 mountain time. 09/13/2007 17:25:17 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: will do 09/13/2007 17:25:31 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: I thought the 'ta' was as in 'thanks' ... so the display only has to be concencedsed. 09/13/2007 17:25:37 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: yes that's right 09/13/2007 17:25:39 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: :-) 09/13/2007 17:25:44 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: That's much simpler, then. 09/13/2007 17:25:50 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: See you at office hours, then. 09/13/2007 17:25:54 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: see you then 09/13/2007 17:26:01 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: See you there. Bye, everyone. 09/13/2007 17:26:03 PM from Alexander Diehl to All Participants: Someone save the chat please 09/13/2007 17:26:04 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: bye 09/13/2007 17:26:05 PM from Midori Harris to All Participants: bye 09/13/2007 17:26:06 PM from Erika to All Participants: Bye 09/13/2007 17:26:08 PM from John Day-Richter to All Participants: I'll save it. 09/13/2007 17:26:10 PM from Jen Deegan to All Participants: I'll save the chat