OE Webex 3Jan08

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01/03/2008    17:30:08 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	hey

01/03/2008    17:30:09 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Wow, you guys are prompt!

01/03/2008    17:30:29 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	just back from more snow shovelling!

01/03/2008    17:30:37 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Where are you?

01/03/2008    17:30:48 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	Maine 8-(

01/03/2008    17:30:55 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Oh.  That explains it.

01/03/2008    17:31:31 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I'm not sure how many people will be participating today.

01/03/2008    17:31:34 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Jen is still away.

01/03/2008    17:32:01 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	ooh, hi (was lookingt OBO-Edit itself ...)

01/03/2008    17:33:01 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Let's wait another two minutes or so and then we can start, ok?

01/03/2008    17:33:16 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	'k

01/03/2008    17:35:13 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Ok, shall we go ahead?  Let's talk about the obsolete id thing.

01/03/2008    17:35:42 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Hi, David

01/03/2008    17:35:44 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	What timing!

01/03/2008    17:35:54 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	We were just about to discuss the obsolete id issue.

01/03/2008    17:36:09 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I think what midori proposed qualifies as a feature request and should be added to SF as such.

01/03/2008    17:36:14 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I just wanted to clarify one thing:

01/03/2008    17:36:23 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	Hiya

01/03/2008    17:36:32 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	midori said "What we'd really like to see, though, is for obomerge 

to replace the alt_id with the corresponding primary ID in the output 

file, everywhere it occurs (except the alt_id tag itself, of course).

01/03/2008    17:36:55 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Does that mean this should only happen for obomerge

01/03/2008    17:36:59 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	and not for regular OBO-Edit loading?

01/03/2008    17:37:18 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Because the way it works now is that the obo loader doesn't know it's loading for later merging--it is just loading.

01/03/2008    17:37:21 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	good question, and one I hadn't really thought about

01/03/2008    17:37:41 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	I would think you would

01/03/2008    17:37:42 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	If we want different behavior to happen well down inside the parser like that, we need to have some sort of "this is for obomerge" flag that can be seen by all the relevant methods

01/03/2008    17:37:59 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	which is doable, but obviously a bit more work.

01/03/2008    17:38:06 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I don't think it would do any harm to fill in the primary ID everywhere, so I think it's not just for obomerge.

01/03/2008    17:38:38 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	It might be easier if it just flags any occurence of a secondary id outside of the synonyms

01/03/2008    17:38:46 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	It's just that it has come up in the context of obomerge because that's pretty much the only time we encounter the situation.

01/03/2008    17:38:47 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	"Flags" meaning what?

01/03/2008    17:38:53 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Prints a warning and continues?

01/03/2008    17:38:58 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	I think the question is - what is the behaviour of oboedit on merging terms - which lead to the creation of alt_ids in the first place.

01/03/2008    17:39:01 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	?

01/03/2008    17:39:20 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	If it sees one (say in a def or comment, it would bring it up as  does a save

01/03/2008    17:39:24 PM    from melissaH to All Participants:

	hey, sorry I am late. webex wouldn't let me on.



01/03/2008    17:39:29 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Oh, is the only way there could be alt_ids in the obo file if someone had merged it previously?

01/03/2008    17:39:30 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	I think consider and replace are just treateed like any other relationship and so should be changed during the term merge

01/03/2008    17:39:40 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Hi, Mel!

01/03/2008    17:39:55 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	the merging is between terms in an obo file, rather than between files

01/03/2008    17:39:55 PM    from suzi to All Participants:

	Hi, I finally figured this out too

01/03/2008    17:39:55 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	We're discussing obomerge and alt_ids.

01/03/2008    17:40:05 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	So, David, you feel that the behavior should be different for obomerge vs. obo loading?

01/03/2008    17:40:25 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	David - we're talking about both term merges and obomerge, which is part of the confusion.

01/03/2008    17:40:25 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Whereas midori thinks they should be the same?

01/03/2008    17:40:29 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Am I getting this right?

01/03/2008    17:40:42 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I'm getting lost in the overlapping threads

01/03/2008    17:41:05 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Sorry.  I will try not to interrupt.

01/03/2008    17:41:15 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	I think that if merging of terms occurs correctly during normal editing, then a single file shouldn't have refs to alt_ids in the first place.

01/03/2008    17:41:30 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	David -- I think that's correct.

01/03/2008    17:41:45 PM    from melissaH to All Participants:

	really? wouldn't you keep thos alt IDs from the merged away term?



01/03/2008    17:41:53 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	So the obo file with the dangling alt_id is buggy (possibly because of other bugs or inadequacies in OBO-Edit)?

01/03/2008    17:42:17 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I think it's because of obomerge not doing what we really want.

01/03/2008    17:42:49 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	The obo file had previously gone through obomerge and it had not done the desired thing, you mean?

01/03/2008    17:42:51 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	Dangling alt_ids are a potential result of merging 2 internally consitent obo files

01/03/2008    17:43:24 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Nomi - not exactly; I think David's closer. I'll go step-by-step in the next few comments ...

01/03/2008    17:44:10 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	1. Start with a file that (a) has two terms and (b) will be the 'parent' file when we get around to using obomerge.

01/03/2008    17:45:32 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	2. Branch off one version of the file in which you merge two terms.

01/03/2008    17:46:03 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	3. Meanwhile, do some other edits in another file, in which you don't merge the terms.

01/03/2008    17:46:43 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	The two files from steps 2 and 3 will be the ones you feed to obomerge (along with the parent from step 1). 

01/03/2008    17:47:06 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	In file 2, one term has an alt_id, but that ID is still a primary ID in file 3.

01/03/2008    17:47:42 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	4. Obomerge, doing whatever one has to do to get the term merge in file 3 to be recognized as a change to keep.

01/03/2008    17:48:11 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Oops, I said the merge was in file 2. Mistype.

01/03/2008    17:49:38 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Ok.  I think I understand what you mean.

01/03/2008    17:49:57 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Anyway, the important thing is that one of the 'child' files has changed an ID to an alt_id, while the other file still uses that id in is_a, relationship, consider and/or replaced_by tags.

01/03/2008    17:50:16 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	exactly

01/03/2008    17:50:25 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	The obomerge result should use the primary ID everywhere.

01/03/2008    17:50:39 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Ok.  Do you agree that this is a new feature request?

01/03/2008    17:51:17 PM    from melissaH to All Participants:

	but keep the alt ID too?



01/03/2008    17:51:38 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	"but keep the alt ID too?" of course - every ID is sacred...

01/03/2008    17:51:40 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I guess ... I think we always wanted obomerge to do this, so it's not "new" in that sense. But it isn't doing it now, and I'm happy to create a feature request SF item if that's the best way to make it happen.

01/03/2008    17:52:17 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Yes -- the alt_id will continue to exist in one place -- the alt_id tag in the stanza for the merged term.

01/03/2008    17:52:48 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	You can add it as a bug if you prefer.  It could be seen as a bug if this behavior had been requested in the original obomerge spec.

01/03/2008    17:52:49 PM    from melissaH to All Participants:

	ok good, just checking....





01/03/2008    17:52:58 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Anyway, it seems somewhat complicated and I'm not sure I'll be able to fix it.

01/03/2008    17:53:11 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I can't remember if we requested it, or just wanted it ;)

01/03/2008    17:53:17 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	However, it looks like we will be making an offer to a new OBO-Edit developer.

01/03/2008    17:53:33 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	She is awaiting a visa, which hopefully will come through in the next few weeks.

01/03/2008    17:54:03 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Amina?

01/03/2008    17:54:15 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Yes, although I didn't want to say because we haven't made an actual offer yet.

01/03/2008    17:54:35 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I won't tell (and I can redact the chat transcript if you want).

01/03/2008    17:54:54 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Suzi can decide whether that's necessary.  (Hi Suzi!)

01/03/2008    17:55:22 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	So, I was looking at a bug submitted by melissa

01/03/2008    17:55:24 PM    from suzi to All Participants:

	Hi

01/03/2008    17:55:30 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	that says: "can we implement a check for format version at save time? maybe just a "are

you sure you want this format" box?

we keep accidentally saving as 1.0 and screwing up our plural synonyms. Or

is there a way to turn off this option? "

01/03/2008    17:55:56 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	What I've now done is made 1.2 the default save format for both OBO-Edit 2 and obomerge.

01/03/2008    17:56:04 PM    from melissaH to All Participants:

	terrific!!



01/03/2008    17:56:08 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	You can of course ask for 1.0 if you want it.

01/03/2008    17:56:09 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	yay!

01/03/2008    17:56:11 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	That works for me.

01/03/2008    17:56:30 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Do you agree that this removes the need for the "Are you sure?" popup (which would surely be annoying much of the time)?

01/03/2008    17:56:51 PM    from melissaH to All Participants:

	yes



01/03/2008    17:56:54 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Great.

01/03/2008    17:57:04 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Has anyone (other than Jen) tried the new 1.2-enabled obomerge yet?

01/03/2008    17:57:14 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Sorry, which "are you sure" popup did you mean?

01/03/2008    17:57:26 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	"can we implement a check for format version at save time? maybe just a "are

you sure you want this format" box?"

01/03/2008    17:57:56 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	oh, yes, then - definitely no need

01/03/2008    17:58:06 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	anyway, no, I haven't tried obomerge in months ...

01/03/2008    17:58:09 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I would like to test the new obomerge.

01/03/2008    17:58:19 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	The files Jen sent me to test it contained that alt_id issue

01/03/2008    17:58:19 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	"Has anyone (other than Jen) tried the new 1.2-enabled obomerge yet?" No, sorry - will try to give it a spin next week.sometime.

01/03/2008    17:58:36 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	so I was not able to complete the test, since it choked on that alt_id.

01/03/2008    17:58:56 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I made some fake tests with little ontologies, and they seemed to work

01/03/2008    17:58:59 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I might be able to try too, soonish ...

01/03/2008    17:59:05 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	but clearly we need more testing.

01/03/2008    17:59:30 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	And I need to make sure there are v1.2 obomerge tests in the test suite.

01/03/2008    17:59:34 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I've been bogged down with trying to test and document the new hotkey system -- it's slow going.

01/03/2008    17:59:42 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Thanks for working on that.

01/03/2008    18:00:18 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I have to admit, I'm not impressed with OBO-Edit's performance ... 

01/03/2008    18:00:27 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	performance in terms of speed?

01/03/2008    18:01:09 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Partly spedd (or lack thereof; also, the hotkeys sometimes don't work, and I can't really tell why. It seems to be intermittent.

01/03/2008    18:01:19 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Ugh.

01/03/2008    18:01:23 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	(er, speed ... can't type today)

01/03/2008    18:01:32 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Those intermittent bugs are hard to track down.

01/03/2008    18:01:47 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Also, it seems that OBO-Edit 2 may have a memory leak (which may also be dragging down performance).

01/03/2008    18:02:22 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	Not the first.

01/03/2008    18:02:24 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Those are a big pain to fix.  Mark Gibson used some tool to help track down memory leaks in Apollo--maybe the new OBO-Edit developer can try that.

01/03/2008    18:02:36 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	I have noticed a drop in search speed, just setting the search to look at term names and synonyms only

01/03/2008    18:02:44 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	And drag-and-drop generally seems fiddly ... choppy movements, not smooth ... generally hard to describe in a bug report as well as hard to fix.

01/03/2008    18:03:14 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Choppy drag-and-drop also sounds like it could be too much memory use affecting performance.

01/03/2008    18:03:27 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	The drag and drop seems to always lag; that is, I do the drag; then I should wait a sec for everythiing to catch up

01/03/2008    18:03:39 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	That does sound annoying.

01/03/2008    18:03:45 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	And, on top of that, just about every time I go to test, I wind up finding something that is pretty straightforward to describe in a bug report!

01/03/2008    18:04:16 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	So you feel like it should have been caught and fixed already, you mean?

01/03/2008    18:04:53 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Not sure that occurred to me ... I was whining about the interruption ;)

01/03/2008    18:05:34 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Clearly OBO-Edit 2 is not yet ready for prime time.  If John had stayed longer, I'm sure he could have fixed a lot of these issues.

01/03/2008    18:05:46 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Some of the bugs are new, tho. e.g. the missing destroy warning (today's SF 1863272)

01/03/2008    18:05:56 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	It will take the new OBO-Edit developer a while to become proficient enough to attack some of these problems.

01/03/2008    18:06:27 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	"the missing destroy warning " Scary!

01/03/2008    18:06:40 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	yup.

01/03/2008    18:06:45 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	I think speed/performance issues are always going to be hard to pin due to differences in everyone's hardware. 

01/03/2008    18:07:23 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	John just laughed at me when I told him my laptop only had 512MB ram

01/03/2008    18:07:38 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Well, it's true that it's hard to get an objective measure of speed when performance is dependent on hardware and memory.

01/03/2008    18:07:48 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Perhaps, but I've been thinking that if a given machine can run O-E 1.1, it should also be able to run 2.0 at least almost as fast and smoothly.

01/03/2008    18:07:52 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	But performance issues are also hard because there's usually no one obvious place to check.

01/03/2008    18:08:04 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	There can be many little inefficiencies that add up to poor performance.

01/03/2008    18:08:19 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I was afraid of that ...

01/03/2008    18:09:09 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	But I agree with midori that if you can run OE1.1 well and OE2 runs unacceptably slowly, then something is wrong.

01/03/2008    18:09:29 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	I try mostly to not use all of the grahics enhancements, and do edits like I do in 1.1, but I wonder if there is overhead even if I have the graphics panels off.

01/03/2008    18:09:42 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	... but I think it's actually the main problem plaguing O-E 2 right now. All of the other more specific bugs would be easier to document (and hopefully therefore easier to fix) in a smooth-running O-E.

01/03/2008    18:10:07 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I'm sure they would, but that's not going to happen anytime soon, I'm sorry to say.

01/03/2008    18:10:28 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I will try to take a look at the missing destroy warning, though.

01/03/2008    18:10:55 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Another bad bug is the one nicole reported as "save messed up"

01/03/2008    18:11:22 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	which I realized was probably the same problem as the one I reported as "Canceling "Running ID Check" window leaves vestigial windows"

01/03/2008    18:11:32 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Have you guys encountered that one?

01/03/2008    18:11:45 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I haven't tried saving since b24 or so. I could check now ...

01/03/2008    18:11:47 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	Using OE2 mainly as a viewer right now - but speed not so much of an issue on new mac with 2 GB ram.  So perhaps soln for now will be to splash out on more ram if poss?

01/03/2008    18:12:03 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	More memory definitely wouldn't hurt!

01/03/2008    18:12:07 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	It's not that expensive these days.

01/03/2008    18:12:15 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	And ontologies aren't getting any smaller, you know!

01/03/2008    18:12:44 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	My bug report that I just referred to is http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1853551&group_id=36855&atid=418257

01/03/2008    18:13:00 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I think bugs that break Save are particularly bad.

01/03/2008    18:13:17 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I agree.

01/03/2008    18:13:46 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	However, I think that one will be complicated to fix, because it seems like it involves threads and grabbing focus and stuff like that.

01/03/2008    18:14:23 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	At least once I figured out how I got into that bad state, it became possible to avoid getting into it.

01/03/2008    18:14:40 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I mean, as a user.

01/03/2008    18:15:16 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Ok, any other topics for today?

01/03/2008    18:15:43 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Documentation:

01/03/2008    18:15:57 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Yes?

01/03/2008    18:16:15 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I noticed that a lot of screenshots need to be updated, including some in sections that don't need any other changes.

01/03/2008    18:16:29 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	And you're volunteering to update them?  That's great!  Thanks!

01/03/2008    18:16:43 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	yea!

01/03/2008    18:16:51 PM    from melissaH to All Participants:

	thanks midori!



01/03/2008    18:17:09 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Happy to. Also, do you want me to make a note on the wiki of pages that I think are good to go because they don't need changes?

01/03/2008    18:17:25 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	If you want, but will that list get long?

01/03/2008    18:17:52 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	If you're willing to make such a list, it would be nice to have, but don't spend too much time on it.

01/03/2008    18:18:03 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I know there's a lot more than needs to be done on the help pages.

01/03/2008    18:18:16 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I committed some changes right before the holidays and haven't done any more since then.

01/03/2008    18:18:37 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	I don't know yet. At present there are a whopping two. How 'bout if I note them as I go along, but don't make a specific effort to find all at this stage?

01/03/2008    18:18:45 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Sounds good.

01/03/2008    18:19:01 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Anything else?

01/03/2008    18:19:59 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I will be away for the next week

01/03/2008    18:20:02 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Yes: where's the file for ontology editor panel documentation? I thought it would be 'The_Ontology_Editor_Panel', but there's no file by that name in the svn html docs directory.

01/03/2008    18:20:12 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	(oops, sorry to interrupt, midori)

01/03/2008    18:20:23 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I will locate it and email you, ok?

01/03/2008    18:20:54 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Anyway, I wanted to let you all know that I will be checking email over the next week but will probably not be able to do much actual work.

01/03/2008    18:20:57 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	ok

01/03/2008    18:21:21 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I probably could do a webex meeting next Thurs, but should we maybe just skip it?

01/03/2008    18:22:10 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	no strong preference ...

01/03/2008    18:22:46 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	How about is the default is to skip it, unless something comes up during the week that could be productively discussed at it?

01/03/2008    18:22:53 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	(btw, I tried saving, and I can get the vestigial windows ... but the closable one comes out on top)

01/03/2008    18:23:03 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	Harold's suggestion sounds okx to me.

01/03/2008    18:23:06 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	That could be OS-dependent.

01/03/2008    18:23:16 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Harold's suggestion?

01/03/2008    18:23:37 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	"

How about is the default is to skip it, unless something comes up during the week that could be productively discussed at it?" yep - fine with me.

01/03/2008    18:23:46 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	?

01/03/2008    18:24:09 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Harold's suggestion about what?

01/03/2008    18:24:09 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	oops, not only can't type also can't read now ...

01/03/2008    18:24:18 PM    from melissaH to All Participants:

	yeah, fine with me too. I'm shirking my OE duties right now anyway....





01/03/2008    18:24:20 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	sounds good to me

01/03/2008    18:24:26 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Ok.  I guess I confused you for a minute there with my Harold mask!

01/03/2008    18:24:42 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	yeah, that must be it!

01/03/2008    18:24:47 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I also wanted to mention that after I get back,

01/03/2008    18:24:49 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	if  you say I said and you like it

01/03/2008    18:25:05 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I will be spending much of my time on another project (a web-based phenotype annotation viewer)

01/03/2008    18:25:16 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	and thus will not be able to spend a lot of time on OBO-Edit.

01/03/2008    18:25:23 PM    from suzi to All Participants:

	Hopefully Amina will be with us by then

01/03/2008    18:25:28 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Right.

01/03/2008    18:26:06 PM    from melissaH to All Participants:

	nomi- is it an extension of phenote, obd, or something else?



01/03/2008    18:26:17 PM    from David OS to All Participants:

	'web-based phenotype annotation viewer ' sounds cool.  Definitely interested to find out more.

01/03/2008    18:26:19 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Suzi, do you want to comment?

01/03/2008    18:27:34 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Anyway, I just wanted to remind everyone to try obomerge, and to supply me with some good examples (parent, modified file 1, modified file 2).

01/03/2008    18:28:00 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	And keep logging bugs and feature requests.

01/03/2008    18:28:24 PM    from suzi to All Participants:

	Basically it is a front-end to a database in which we've gather zfin, fly, mouse, worm, and human phenotype data structured using PATO

01/03/2008    18:29:44 PM    from suzi to All Participants:

	Melissa has helped with some of the annotation for zfin, and Michael A. for the fly, George Gkoutos for mouse (with Chris), and human by one and all

01/03/2008    18:29:45 PM    from melissaH to All Participants:

	oh thats terrific- so an extension of the the stuff chris showed at the biocurator meeting?



01/03/2008    18:30:26 PM    from Harold to All Participants:

	(need to sneak off to other meeting; bye all; send transcript)

01/03/2008    18:30:37 PM    from suzi to All Participants:

	Yep, thats right. I've asked Nomi to start with a paste-up and then you all can tell us how useful it is. The normal user feedback loop

01/03/2008    18:30:40 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	will do

01/03/2008    18:30:42 PM    from suzi to All Participants:

	ciao Harold

01/03/2008    18:31:09 PM    from suzi to All Participants:

	I should go too

01/03/2008    18:31:20 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	time's up anyway ...

01/03/2008    18:31:21 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	I think we're done

01/03/2008    18:31:24 PM    from Nomi Harris to All Participants:

	Bye, all!

01/03/2008    18:31:27 PM    from suzi to All Participants:

	bye

01/03/2008    18:31:27 PM    from midori to All Participants:

	see you next time, then