03/11/2008 09:27:52 AM from Tanya Berardini: Hi there!
03/11/2008 09:28:06 AM from Tanya Berardini: knock wood
03/11/2008 09:28:50 AM from Tanya Berardini: David is connecting
03/11/2008 09:28:51 AM from Tanya Berardini: oh,
03/11/2008 09:28:53 AM from Tanya Berardini: he's in
03/11/2008 09:28:58 AM from Nomi Harris: Wow, people are very prompt this morning! My clock says 9:28.
03/11/2008 09:29:01 AM from Alexander Diehl: Jen, change to All Particpants.
03/11/2008 09:29:13 AM from Jen Deegan: Hi Nomi, is recording disabled?
03/11/2008 09:29:15 AM from Tanya Berardini: Jen, David does not want to be recorded.
03/11/2008 09:29:19 AM from Tanya Berardini: :)
03/11/2008 09:29:19 AM from Jen Deegan: oh
03/11/2008 09:29:23 AM from Jen Deegan: ok :-)
03/11/2008 09:29:25 AM from Tanya Berardini: You can prod him though.
03/11/2008 09:29:34 AM from Jen Deegan: it's okay I think everyone is coming anyway
03/11/2008 09:29:37 AM from Nomi Harris: I neither enabled nor disabled recording.
03/11/2008 09:29:42 AM from Jen Deegan: good-oh
03/11/2008 09:29:56 AM from Tanya Berardini: Nomi, can you pass control to David already so we can get set up?
03/11/2008 09:30:06 AM from Nomi Harris: Yes
03/11/2008 09:30:20 AM from Jen Deegan: are we starting with 1.101 or 2?
03/11/2008 09:30:31 AM from Tanya Berardini: 1.101 is all we're doing for now
03/11/2008 09:30:37 AM from Jen Deegan: righto
03/11/2008 09:30:48 AM from Nomi Harris: DavidH is the host now.
03/11/2008 09:31:12 AM from Jen Deegan: which file are you going to load?
03/11/2008 09:32:39 AM from Tanya Berardini: Nomi, I dont' think everyone can see your comments.
03/11/2008 09:33:00 AM from Harold: I see no comments
03/11/2008 09:33:51 AM from Nomi Harris: Sometimes I'm seeing the OE window, but other times I just see a black screen with an arrow cursor moving around.
03/11/2008 09:34:05 AM from midori: same here, plus sometimes just a field of green
03/11/2008 09:34:15 AM from midori: I see O-E now ...
03/11/2008 09:34:17 AM from Harold: lets stop until everyone can see the same thing
03/11/2008 09:34:18 AM from Tanya Berardini: Sorry, we're figuring out how to best display ;stuff.
03/11/2008 09:34:23 AM from Tanya Berardini: I'm on Skype with David
03/11/2008 09:34:28 AM from Tanya Berardini: and will type out what he's doing.
03/11/2008 09:34:30 AM from David OS: I'm just getting the green field too
03/11/2008 09:34:31 AM from midori: (and wow, that def needs work)
03/11/2008 09:34:31 AM from Nomi Harris: Ok.
03/11/2008 09:34:33 AM from Tanya Berardini: When shall we start?
03/11/2008 09:34:40 AM from Nomi Harris: (Yes, I was thinking that def was a bit weak!)
03/11/2008 09:34:55 AM from Nomi Harris: I think you can go ahead and start.
03/11/2008 09:35:12 AM from Tanya Berardini: For this example, we've loaded up the file go_regtest_withPosNeg_noPF_noXP.obo
03/11/2008 09:35:17 AM from midori: Nomi, you're on 'all attendees'
03/11/2008 09:35:25 AM from Nomi Harris: Argh
03/11/2008 09:35:28 AM from Nomi Harris: Why is that the default?
03/11/2008 09:35:34 AM from Tanya Berardini: which is in the go/scratch/regulates_test_files (or something like that)
03/11/2008 09:35:34 AM from midori: ?????
03/11/2008 09:35:38 AM from Nomi Harris: Anyway, David and Tanya, please go ahead and start whenever you're ready.
03/11/2008 09:35:45 AM from Tanya Berardini: OK, ready to start.
03/11/2008 09:35:59 AM from Tanya Berardini: You have to go into the Global Filter Plugins and
03/11/2008 09:36:06 AM from Tanya Berardini: make sure that all you are left with in the LInk Filters
03/11/2008 09:36:13 AM from Tanya Berardini: is what David has showing now
03/11/2008 09:36:26 AM from Tanya Berardini: IMPT:
03/11/2008 09:36:35 AM from Tanya Berardini: get rid of the one that had to do with 'transitive' links
03/11/2008 09:36:41 AM from Tanya Berardini: Save changes
03/11/2008 09:36:50 AM from Tanya Berardini: we are demonstrating adding a regulation term to cell deat
03/11/2008 09:36:52 AM from Tanya Berardini: death
03/11/2008 09:36:56 AM from Tanya Berardini: add new term as usual
03/11/2008 09:37:03 AM from Tanya Berardini: add term name as usual
03/11/2008 09:37:14 AM from Tanya Berardini: change relationship type to ''regulates'
03/11/2008 09:37:25 AM from Tanya Berardini: (please interrupt if we're going too fast)
03/11/2008 09:37:27 AM from Tanya Berardini: ok
03/11/2008 09:37:37 AM from Tanya Berardini: now, you need to find a 'regulation parent'
03/11/2008 09:37:43 AM from Tanya Berardini: for a biological process term,
03/11/2008 09:37:52 AM from Tanya Berardini: this will be something under regulation of biological process
03/11/2008 09:38:04 AM from Tanya Berardini: click on cell death and look at its graph
03/11/2008 09:38:06 AM from Tanya Berardini: like this
03/11/2008 09:38:16 AM from Tanya Berardini: it is_a death
03/11/2008 09:38:17 AM from Tanya Berardini: and it
03/11/2008 09:38:23 AM from Tanya Berardini: is_a cellular developmental process
03/11/2008 09:38:26 AM from Tanya Berardini: we don't have either of those
03/11/2008 09:38:32 AM from Tanya Berardini: regulation terms
03/11/2008 09:38:34 AM from Tanya Berardini: so
03/11/2008 09:38:39 AM from Tanya Berardini: it's up to the curator
03/11/2008 09:38:45 AM from Tanya Berardini: whether they would like to create
03/11/2008 09:38:47 AM from Tanya Berardini: regulation of deat
03/11/2008 09:38:49 AM from Tanya Berardini: death
03/11/2008 09:38:57 AM from Tanya Berardini: or regulation of cellular developmental process
03/11/2008 09:39:01 AM from Tanya Berardini: if you do not
03/11/2008 09:39:15 AM from Tanya Berardini: then this new regulation term goes to the best existing child
03/11/2008 09:39:19 AM from Tanya Berardini: which in this example is
03/11/2008 09:39:25 AM from Tanya Berardini: regulation of developmental process
03/11/2008 09:39:32 AM from Tanya Berardini: note that it ALSO
03/11/2008 09:39:35 AM from Tanya Berardini: has to go to
03/11/2008 09:39:40 AM from Tanya Berardini: regulation of cellular process
03/11/2008 09:39:49 AM from Tanya Berardini: since we did not create the compound term
03/11/2008 09:39:55 AM from Tanya Berardini: regulation of cellular developmental process
03/11/2008 09:40:04 AM from Tanya Berardini: any questions so far?
03/11/2008 09:40:09 AM from Tanya Berardini: or shall we proceed?
03/11/2008 09:40:17 AM from Jen Deegan: fine by me
03/11/2008 09:40:37 AM from Tanya Berardini: moving on then
03/11/2008 09:40:57 AM from Tanya Berardini: now we're going to create a negative regulation of cell death term
03/11/2008 09:41:03 AM from Tanya Berardini: and deal with this term's parentage
03/11/2008 09:41:07 AM from Tanya Berardini: same deal
03/11/2008 09:41:09 AM from Tanya Berardini: new term
03/11/2008 09:41:11 AM from Tanya Berardini: new term name
03/11/2008 09:41:17 AM from Tanya Berardini: change relationship type
03/11/2008 09:41:21 AM from Tanya Berardini: all the old familiar stuff
03/11/2008 09:41:33 AM from Tanya Berardini: now,
03/11/2008 09:41:38 AM from Tanya Berardini: we don't have neg reg of death
03/11/2008 09:41:48 AM from Tanya Berardini: sorry, David's mouse is being spastic
03/11/2008 09:41:56 AM from Tanya Berardini: we do have neg reg of cellular process
03/11/2008 09:42:07 AM from Tanya Berardini: so now this has a neg reg parent
03/11/2008 09:42:13 AM from Tanya Berardini: we also should add it to
03/11/2008 09:42:17 AM from Tanya Berardini: neg reg of dev process
03/11/2008 09:42:33 AM from Tanya Berardini: just like the parent term was added to reg of both cell and dev process
03/11/2008 09:42:39 AM from Tanya Berardini: now
03/11/2008 09:42:45 AM from Tanya Berardini: we go back to cell death
03/11/2008 09:43:09 AM from Tanya Berardini: and make a negative regulates relationship between the neg reg of cell death and the term cell death itself
03/11/2008 09:43:25 AM from Tanya Berardini: The final result, viewed in the Graphviz view is here.
03/11/2008 09:43:33 AM from Tanya Berardini: That's all folks.
03/11/2008 09:43:43 AM from Tanya Berardini: Don't worry if you don't get all the parents right
03/11/2008 09:43:52 AM from Tanya Berardini: Chris will find them with his brilliant scripts
03/11/2008 09:43:57 AM from Tanya Berardini: and we will fix them
03/11/2008 09:44:07 AM from midori: wooooo
03/11/2008 09:44:08 AM from Jen Deegan: what about children of negative regulation of cell death?
03/11/2008 09:44:12 AM from Tanya Berardini: as we'll be reviewing the QC reports on a regular basis
03/11/2008 09:44:23 AM from Tanya Berardini: Jen, ok.
03/11/2008 09:44:30 AM from Tanya Berardini: Good question (says David)
03/11/2008 09:44:36 AM from Jen Deegan: Thank you :-)
03/11/2008 09:44:43 AM from Tanya Berardini: Here's new child.
03/11/2008 09:45:24 AM from Tanya Berardini: Let's say this ig going to be neg reg of cell death involved in forebrain development
03/11/2008 09:45:37 AM from Tanya Berardini: Then it becomes quite easy.
03/11/2008 09:45:57 AM from Tanya Berardini: Just make an is_a child of the neg reg term
03/11/2008 09:46:01 AM from jane lomax: ack, the sooner we can get the obol functionality integrated into OE the better - there will be a lot of relations to add by hand now
03/11/2008 09:46:08 AM from Tanya Berardini: Then make it a part_of forebrain development
03/11/2008 09:46:29 AM from Tanya Berardini: You bet!( says David)
03/11/2008 09:46:44 AM from Jen Deegan: can we also do a child process that doesn't have the words 'negative regulation' in it?
03/11/2008 09:46:47 AM from Tanya Berardini: And I agree
03/11/2008 09:47:12 AM from Tanya Berardini: (for David) probably yes, as long as you make the correct is_a parentage
03/11/2008 09:47:24 AM from Tanya Berardini: but it will show up on our QC report as a problem
03/11/2008 09:47:29 AM from Jen Deegan: eh?
03/11/2008 09:47:31 AM from Tanya Berardini: if this really reflects biology that's ok
03/11/2008 09:47:33 AM from Harold: shouldn't the new term have a negatively_regulates relation to forebrain dev?
03/11/2008 09:48:03 AM from midori: not necessarily -- it's negatively regulating cell death.
03/11/2008 09:48:13 AM from Jen Deegan: or an involved_in relationship :-)
03/11/2008 09:48:23 AM from Tanya Berardini: if it's a normal process that occurs during forebrain development then
03/11/2008 09:48:30 AM from Tanya Berardini: it doesn't regulate forebrain development
03/11/2008 09:48:34 AM from Tanya Berardini: it is a part_of it
03/11/2008 09:49:01 AM from Tanya Berardini: We're not going to demo this in OE2 for now because regulates is going live before OE2 does.
03/11/2008 09:49:09 AM from Tanya Berardini: When OE2 does go live, we'll do another demo.
03/11/2008 09:49:22 AM from Tanya Berardini: I apologize if there were other people who wanted to see
03/11/2008 09:49:24 AM from Jen Deegan: can we do a process like 'sprocket coagulation' which happens to be a process that negatively regulates cell death?
03/11/2008 09:49:28 AM from Tanya Berardini: crossproducts in action
03/11/2008 09:49:40 AM from Tanya Berardini: but this is the current training that we'd like to get across.
03/11/2008 09:49:51 AM from Tanya Berardini: Yes
03/11/2008 09:50:17 AM from Tanya Berardini: when it pops up on our QC report, we'll say it's ok and it won't show up again
03/11/2008 09:50:20 AM from Tanya Berardini: we hope
03/11/2008 09:50:20 AM from midori: I don't think I want my sprockets coagulating on me ...
03/11/2008 09:50:22 AM from Harold: Will the reasoner be able to spot errors in parentage?
03/11/2008 09:50:40 AM from Tanya Berardini: YES!
03/11/2008 09:50:45 AM from Jen Deegan: all of them?
03/11/2008 09:50:48 AM from Tanya Berardini: These are the bazillion QC reports that we're looking at.
03/11/2008 09:50:53 AM from Tanya Berardini: WE don't know
03/11/2008 09:50:56 AM from Jen Deegan: :-)
03/11/2008 09:50:59 AM from Tanya Berardini: but it sure spots alot
03/11/2008 09:51:10 AM from Tanya Berardini: enough to keep us busy till we retire
03/11/2008 09:51:13 AM from Jen Deegan: will you demo sprocket coagulation?
03/11/2008 09:51:29 AM from Tanya Berardini: I will ask David nicely.
03/11/2008 09:51:34 AM from Jen Deegan: thank you :-)
03/11/2008 09:51:58 AM from Tanya Berardini: whoops
03/11/2008 09:52:05 AM from Tanya Berardini: you are seeing an OBoEDit expert at work!
03/11/2008 09:52:25 AM from Jen Deegan: I'm very impressed!
03/11/2008 09:52:53 AM from Tanya Berardini: You've taught him all he knows.
03/11/2008 09:53:11 AM from Tanya Berardini: Oh dear.
03/11/2008 09:53:22 AM from Tanya Berardini: Find that undo button!
03/11/2008 09:53:36 AM from Tanya Berardini: He's good at undoing.
03/11/2008 09:53:50 AM from Jen Deegan: would it be possibl to make the ontology editor panel wider?
03/11/2008 09:54:23 AM from DavidH: tanya just got dumped from the meeting
03/11/2008 09:54:25 AM from Harold: green screen of death
03/11/2008 09:54:32 AM from Jen Deegan: all gone
03/11/2008 09:54:37 AM from Jen Deegan: back
03/11/2008 09:54:38 AM from Tanya Berardini: I'm back
03/11/2008 09:54:48 AM from Tanya Berardini: First time I got kicked out of a webex meeting.
03/11/2008 09:54:56 AM from midori: welcome to the club
03/11/2008 09:55:08 AM from Tanya Berardini: never happened on my Windows machine before
03/11/2008 09:55:19 AM from Tanya Berardini: ooooh
03/11/2008 09:55:21 AM from Tanya Berardini: I'm cloned
03/11/2008 09:55:31 AM from Tanya Berardini: Where's that spell check?
03/11/2008 09:55:38 AM from Tanya Berardini: Jen, is sprocket coagulation part of anything?
03/11/2008 09:55:45 AM from Jen Deegan: um
03/11/2008 09:55:51 AM from Jen Deegan: no I don't think so
03/11/2008 09:56:02 AM from Jen Deegan: it's just a type of negative regulation of cell death
03/11/2008 09:56:02 AM from Tanya Berardini: well, then, that's all
03/11/2008 09:56:04 AM from Tanya Berardini: you need
03/11/2008 09:56:13 AM from Jen Deegan: does it get a negatively regulates relationship?
03/11/2008 09:56:13 AM from Tanya Berardini: really
03/11/2008 09:56:19 AM from Jen Deegan: to cell death?
03/11/2008 09:56:32 AM from Tanya Berardini: it does through the is_a path
03/11/2008 09:56:34 AM from midori: wouldn't that be redundant?
03/11/2008 09:56:45 AM from Jen Deegan: oh so it inherits that
03/11/2008 09:56:52 AM from Tanya Berardini: correct
03/11/2008 09:56:54 AM from Jen Deegan: yes I see
03/11/2008 09:56:57 AM from Jen Deegan: gotcha
03/11/2008 09:57:10 AM from Nomi Harris: What's the difference between the top left panel and the bottom left panel?
03/11/2008 09:57:25 AM from Tanya Berardini: no difference
03/11/2008 09:57:30 AM from Tanya Berardini: just different parts of the ontology
03/11/2008 09:57:35 AM from Jen Deegan: any chance of a screenshot of that or something?
03/11/2008 09:57:37 AM from Tanya Berardini: makes it easier to edit
03/11/2008 09:57:51 AM from Tanya Berardini: it will be in the documentation
03/11/2008 09:58:04 AM from Harold: in OE2 you can just add another edit panel
03/11/2008 09:58:05 AM from Tanya Berardini: (which is almost ready for prime time)
03/11/2008 09:58:10 AM from Jen Deegan: I got the screenshot myself
03/11/2008 09:58:13 AM from Harold: to get the same thing
03/11/2008 09:58:16 AM from Tanya Berardini: that's right
03/11/2008 09:58:21 AM from Tanya Berardini: take matters into your own hands
03/11/2008 09:58:30 AM from Tanya Berardini: you can get one later when David commits this to the live go
03/11/2008 09:58:33 AM from Tanya Berardini: :)
03/11/2008 09:58:40 AM from Tanya Berardini: anything else?
03/11/2008 09:58:41 AM from Tanya Berardini: if not,
03/11/2008 09:58:46 AM from Tanya Berardini: I have to go to another meeting
03/11/2008 09:58:53 AM from Nomi Harris: Thank you, Tanya and David, for that demo.
03/11/2008 09:58:53 AM from Jen Deegan: that was brilliant, thanks.
03/11/2008 09:59:00 AM from midori: so we get regulates, + reg and - reg on the 25th?
03/11/2008 09:59:06 AM from Nomi Harris: And I apologize to everyone for the confusion about the meeting time and date!
03/11/2008 09:59:08 AM from Tanya Berardini: Yes ma'am.
03/11/2008 09:59:20 AM from midori: Then I'm cool. But not as cool as you.
03/11/2008 09:59:32 AM from Tanya Berardini: David is going to try to give control back to Nomi.
03/11/2008 09:59:50 AM from Tanya Berardini: He doesn't know how to make you the host again.
03/11/2008 09:59:52 AM from Jen Deegan: Thanks David! That was a magnificent feat of editing.
03/11/2008 09:59:56 AM from Nomi Harris: It still says "DavidH (host") but I now have a green button.
03/11/2008 10:00:08 AM from midori: that means Nomi is presenter
03/11/2008 10:00:09 AM from Tanya Berardini: yes, this means that you can present
03/11/2008 10:00:12 AM from Tanya Berardini: snap!
03/11/2008 10:00:13 AM from Nomi Harris: It doesn't matter, as long as we finish the meeting before David leaves.
03/11/2008 10:00:22 AM from midori: glad we agree!
03/11/2008 10:00:25 AM from Nomi Harris: If the host leaves, the meeting ends.
03/11/2008 10:00:28 AM from Jen Deegan: I just saved the chat, just in case
03/11/2008 10:00:44 AM from midori: nomi, do you have a menu option for 'reclaim host role', under 'participant'?
03/11/2008 10:00:53 AM from Nomi Harris: Yes, I just tried that. It asked for the host key.
03/11/2008 10:00:53 AM from Karen: thanks Tanya, I have to leave now too
03/11/2008 10:00:54 AM from Tanya Berardini: Got to go.
03/11/2008 10:00:56 AM from Tanya Berardini: Bye
03/11/2008 10:01:09 AM from midori: bye, and thanks!
03/11/2008 10:01:16 AM from Nomi Harris: Bye, Tanya and Karen.
03/11/2008 10:01:27 AM from Jen Deegan: Nomi, it's showing you as host for me
03/11/2008 10:01:36 AM from midori: maybe try the webex account password? (disclaimer: I'm guessing!)
03/11/2008 10:01:43 AM from Harold: DavidH is listed as host here
03/11/2008 10:01:51 AM from DavidH: I think you get the host key in you host e-mail
03/11/2008 10:01:51 AM from midori: odd - I have Nomi as presenter but DavidH as host.
03/11/2008 10:01:57 AM from Nomi Harris: Me too
03/11/2008 10:02:04 AM from Jen Deegan: oh yes
03/11/2008 10:02:13 AM from Jen Deegan: misunderstood the beachball
03/11/2008 10:02:22 AM from DavidH: I think I remember reading something about claiming back host privledges when I've hosted
03/11/2008 10:02:46 AM from Nomi Harris: Let's not worry about it--let's just finish any other topics and then we can end the meeting.
03/11/2008 10:02:54 AM from Jen Deegan: David could just leave it running until we are done
03/11/2008 10:03:11 AM from Harold: we need to get the icons decided
03/11/2008 10:03:16 AM �
03/11/2008 10:03:22 AM from Nomi Harris: I didn't do a release between meetings because I am still changing class names for the components (e.g. DAG View -> Tree Viewer).
03/11/2008 10:03:23 AM from Jen Deegan: very urgent!
03/11/2008 10:03:27 AM from DavidH: ok, but I'm going to do other stuff though
03/11/2008 10:03:30 AM from Nomi Harris: Yes, we definitely need to settle on icons.
03/11/2008 10:03:38 AM from Nomi Harris: That's fine, David. There won't be a quiz later.
03/11/2008 10:03:38 AM from Jen Deegan: did everybody see the wiki?
03/11/2008 10:03:46 AM from Harold: and how to get them into OE 1.1
03/11/2008 10:04:13 AM from David OS: wiki?
03/11/2008 10:04:19 AM from Jen Deegan: http://wiki.geneontology.org/index.php/Regulates_icons_in_OBO-Edit
03/11/2008 10:04:26 AM from Jen Deegan: all possible options are there
03/11/2008 10:04:33 AM from Nomi Harris: I am neutral.
03/11/2008 10:04:39 AM from midori: me too
03/11/2008 10:04:48 AM from Jen Deegan: Amelia is to figure something out and send it back poste haste so this is the time to say what you think
03/11/2008 10:05:12 AM from Jen Deegan: I like the black arrow ones amelia made if they were a bit bigger
03/11/2008 10:05:14 AM from Nomi Harris: I think the arrows are nice in a big size but suffer somewhat when they are shrunk.
03/11/2008 10:05:23 AM from Jen Deegan: I think if the svgs had worked they might have been bigger
03/11/2008 10:05:33 AM from Harold: I just had david tranfer host to Nomi
03/11/2008 10:05:37 AM from Jen Deegan: I also like the blue letter ones for legibility
03/11/2008 10:05:46 AM �
03/11/2008 10:06:13 AM from Nomi Harris: Jen, I'm not sure the arrow svgs would be bigger. The way they are now, they are as tall as the is_a icon.
03/11/2008 10:06:46 AM from Jen Deegan: do you think so?
03/11/2008 10:06:50 AM from Nomi Harris: The blue ones are good. I don't love the yellowish-background black ones.
03/11/2008 10:06:50 AM from Jen Deegan: they seemed smaller to me
03/11/2008 10:06:59 AM from Jen Deegan: I agree
03/11/2008 10:07:07 AM from Jen Deegan: the yellowish background is a bit funny
03/11/2008 10:07:21 AM from Jen Deegan: I think the big letters stand out well
03/11/2008 10:07:25 AM from gwg: what I would like to do is to create an icon set where the letter are all of the same size
03/11/2008 10:07:26 AM from Nomi Harris: The biggest dimension of each arrow looks to me to match the is_a icon.
03/11/2008 10:07:38 AM from Nomi Harris: However, since the arrows are not round, their smaller dimension is not as big as the is_a icon.
03/11/2008 10:07:47 AM from gwg: currently the size of the letter is somewhat dependent on the shape it's in
03/11/2008 10:07:53 AM from Jen Deegan: yes it's true
03/11/2008 10:08:01 AM from Jen Deegan: I found that difficult to handle too
03/11/2008 10:08:11 AM from Nomi Harris: Yes, it would look nicer if the R were the same size in all three icons.
03/11/2008 10:08:13 AM from Jen Deegan: even with square icons they went oblong in oboedit
03/11/2008 10:08:40 AM from Jen Deegan: Nomi, are you looking at the AmiGO screenshot or the oboedit one?
03/11/2008 10:08:42 AM from gwg: I can spend a bit more time on it if people would like - those icons were just a first draft really
03/11/2008 10:08:47 AM from Nomi Harris: oboedit
03/11/2008 10:08:50 AM from Jen Deegan: oh good
03/11/2008 10:09:00 AM from Nomi Harris: Well, both, actually.
03/11/2008 10:09:03 AM from Jen Deegan: We seem to be getting a bit pressed for time
03/11/2008 10:09:12 AM from Nomi Harris: Anyway, I really don't mind which icons are picked. Just let me know and I'll add them to OE2.
03/11/2008 10:09:14 AM from Jen Deegan: would you be able to work on them quite soon?
03/11/2008 10:09:26 AM from Jen Deegan: Chris asked for them by the end of last week
03/11/2008 10:09:38 AM from gwg: I can take a shot at them tomorrow - I just had some AmiGO stuff I needed to do, but I've done that now
03/11/2008 10:09:42 AM from Jen Deegan: great
03/11/2008 10:09:47 AM from Nomi Harris: Who is gwg?
03/11/2008 10:09:50 AM from Jen Deegan: Amelia
03/11/2008 10:09:59 AM from gwg: lol!
03/11/2008 10:09:59 AM from Nomi Harris: Oh. I guess that should have been obvious (???)
03/11/2008 10:10:09 AM from Jen Deegan: not necessarily :-)
03/11/2008 10:10:17 AM from Harold: the Girl With the Glasses
03/11/2008 10:10:29 AM from Nomi Harris: It should be the Girl with the Guitar.
03/11/2008 10:10:35 AM from Harold: ah,I like that one
03/11/2008 10:10:36 AM from Jen Deegan: nice!
03/11/2008 10:10:40 AM from Harold: better
03/11/2008 10:10:41 AM from gwg: Guitar*S*!
03/11/2008 10:10:47 AM from Jen Deegan: :-)
03/11/2008 10:10:59 AM from Nomi Harris: You're coming back to Berkeley after the GO meeting, right, gwg?
03/11/2008 10:11:18 AM from gwg: as long as visa things get sorted, yes :D
03/11/2008 10:11:31 AM from Nomi Harris: Fingers crossed!
03/11/2008 10:11:38 AM from Jen Deegan: so is the plan that Amelia works on getting the sizes better and gets back to us?
03/11/2008 10:11:43 AM from Nomi Harris: Yes
03/11/2008 10:12:16 AM from Jen Deegan: We should just concentrate on the icons people liek most
03/11/2008 10:12:20 AM from gwg: ok, I'll get something done and send it around tomorrow
03/11/2008 10:12:23 AM from Jen Deegan: is that the arrow ones and the blue letter ones?
03/11/2008 10:12:26 AM from Harold: Just occurred to me that the look of the icons may be tied into whatever screen res you have
03/11/2008 10:12:33 AM from gwg: yes, let me know which are the best
03/11/2008 10:12:42 AM from Jen Deegan: anyone keen on the others?
03/11/2008 10:12:49 AM from Nomi Harris: Karen, I'm going to look into that delete problem some more. If you have any more info about what seems to trigger it, please let me know.
03/11/2008 10:13:00 AM from Harold: I've always like the arrow
03/11/2008 10:13:05 AM from Nomi Harris: I thought the triangles were ok.
03/11/2008 10:13:09 AM from Erika: I like the arrows too
03/11/2008 10:13:18 AM from gwg: also, I was thinking it might be better to have the icons of the same colour because otherwise people tend to discriminate based on colour rather than clarity of shape
03/11/2008 10:13:35 AM from gwg: I was going to do black 'n' white icons and then we can worry about a colour afterwards
03/11/2008 10:13:43 AM from Jen Deegan: good idea
03/11/2008 10:13:45 AM from Harold: good
03/11/2008 10:13:47 AM from Nomi Harris: yes
03/11/2008 10:13:49 AM from Jen Deegan: to be honest I like the arrows in black
03/11/2008 10:13:56 AM from Harold: I do also
03/11/2008 10:14:03 AM from Jen Deegan: but as you say, good to leave colour out at this stage
03/11/2008 10:14:29 AM from Harold: but that might be because of how they were surrounded by the terms with the other relationships
03/11/2008 10:14:43 AM from Jen Deegan: it might be good to have the icons actually bigger than the current icons if it means they look the same size, if you see what I mean,
03/11/2008 10:15:13 AM from Nomi Harris: I think OE scales them somehow, though I haven't figured out exactly how it decides on the size.
03/11/2008 10:15:32 AM from Jen Deegan: I thik th
03/11/2008 10:15:34 AM from gwg: it could be that obo-edit could be configured to have icons in certain colours, esp. given that the colours of svgs can be specified as html colour codes
03/11/2008 10:15:39 AM from Jen Deegan: I think that's the problem
03/11/2008 10:15:49 AM from Harold: I think its the size of the letter inside of the arrow that is smaller than the I or P in the other two
03/11/2008 10:16:05 AM from Jen Deegan: yes
03/11/2008 10:16:05 AM from Harold: So to get those to the same size would mean making thearrow larger
03/11/2008 10:16:12 AM from Jen Deegan: but the actual arrow seems smaller to me too
03/11/2008 10:16:26 AM from Nomi Harris: Optical illusion
03/11/2008 10:16:32 AM from Jen Deegan: yes I know
03/11/2008 10:16:34 AM from Nomi Harris: I agree with Harold, it's just the letter r that's smaller.
03/11/2008 10:16:39 AM from Harold: it does to me also
03/11/2008 10:16:44 AM from Jen Deegan: but we need it to be actually bigger to make it appear the samme size
03/11/2008 10:16:55 AM from Nomi Harris: But OE may then just scale it down again to the size it likes.
03/11/2008 10:17:07 AM from Nomi Harris: I will see if I can figure out what's up with that. Amelia, maybe you can make a few different sizes so I can experiment?
03/11/2008 10:17:10 AM from Jen Deegan: on my screen the arrow is *definately* smaller
03/11/2008 10:17:19 AM from gwg: yes, will do
03/11/2008 10:17:21 AM from Harold: is there any .. white space at the tip of the icon itself?
03/11/2008 10:17:21 AM from Jen Deegan: thanks
03/11/2008 10:18:07 AM from Nomi Harris: Ok, Jen, we believe you <pat pat>
03/11/2008 10:18:12 AM from Jen Deegan: Thank you :-)
03/11/2008 10:18:18 AM from Jen Deegan: <sigh>
03/11/2008 10:18:39 AM from Nomi Harris: Any other things to discuss?
03/11/2008 10:18:47 AM from Jen Deegan: nothing from me
03/11/2008 10:19:18 AM from Nomi Harris: I think I've fixed the dangling refs problem
03/11/2008 10:19:23 AM from midori: I've put in a couple more bug reports ... OE performance with the reasoner on is bad again ...
03/11/2008 10:19:32 AM from Nomi Harris: :-(
03/11/2008 10:19:42 AM from Nomi Harris: It got better, and then worse again?
03/11/2008 10:19:42 AM from midori: but we don't have to discuss that now, unelss anyone has a dramatic insight
03/11/2008 10:20:10 AM from midori: Nomi - yes, it did. It's not quite as bad as 1.1x but it's nowhere near as good as it was several betas ago.
03/11/2008 10:20:21 AM from Nomi Harris: Weird. I don't know why that would have changed.
03/11/2008 10:20:33 AM from Nomi Harris: I don't see that bug report.
03/11/2008 10:20:35 AM from midori: to annoy me, perhaps?
03/11/2008 10:20:40 AM from midori: it's new today ...
03/11/2008 10:20:55 AM from midori: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1911989&group_id=36855&atid=418257
03/11/2008 10:21:00 AM from Jen Deegan: maybe somebody pinched Midori's ram
03/11/2008 10:21:17 AM from midori: hmm, 'puter still thinks it's there ;)
03/11/2008 10:21:22 AM from Jen Deegan: :-)
03/11/2008 10:21:24 AM from Nomi Harris: weird, it wasn't showing up when I did browse.
03/11/2008 10:21:34 AM from Nomi Harris: Anyway, I'll see if I can figure out what's up. I didn't change anything in the reasoner.
03/11/2008 10:21:46 AM from midori: frustrating, I know ...
03/11/2008 10:22:20 AM from Nomi Harris: See you all next week?
03/11/2008 10:22:20 AM from David OS: "I think I've fixed the dangling refs problem" - most excellent.
03/11/2008 10:22:28 AM from Nomi Harris: When does the UK switch to summer time?
03/11/2008 10:22:29 AM from midori: well, I oughta get going here ...
03/11/2008 10:22:35 AM from Nomi Harris: (and Europe)
03/11/2008 10:22:39 AM from midori: March 30th
03/11/2008 10:22:40 AM from Jen Deegan: Yes, have a good week.
03/11/2008 10:22:50 AM from Nomi Harris: So we'll meet again at 4:30GMT next week if that's ok with everyone.
03/11/2008 10:22:56 AM from midori: fine with me
03/11/2008 10:23:01 AM from David OS: works for me too
03/11/2008 10:23:03 AM from Nomi Harris: Good.
03/11/2008 10:23:09 AM from Harold: Midori: if you do multiple searches in a row, and it starts slowing down, it might point to a problem outside of the reasoner.